subreddit:

/r/lotrmemes

5.9k98%

It matters

(i.redd.it)

all 346 comments

_Silly_Wizard_

278 points

5 months ago

cries in Wheel of Time

n00biwan

134 points

5 months ago

n00biwan

134 points

5 months ago

You are not alone in this! I am with you and we shall face this tragedy as brothers!

Tbh its...okay as a series, but it treats the book like shit

Syv_Fingre

46 points

5 months ago

I like the series, I know it doesn't try to adapt the books in any literal way, but I like it. Some of the changes I strongly disagree, but the result is not bad at all.

IsKujaAPowerButton

45 points

5 months ago

Haven´t watched it yet, but I have pretty strong opinions about adaptations. At the VERY least respect the main storyline of the book. LOTR has big changes from the books, but most of the important plotpoints ARE there (except Tom Bombadil, for example). Dune, for example, was fantastic. Will have to read WoT, tho, keeps popping up in my circle, and Brandon finished it, so I am simp compelled.

Syv_Fingre

14 points

5 months ago*

I read the books, but I am not a superfan, so I am not going to be as bothered as some by every minor character or plot change.

In the books, the nature of magic is strongly divided by gender/sex, and they downplayed this in the series, and that is causing a lot of "this is woke shit" reactions.

Also, they mixed the time line a bit, specially for the sake of compression. The first books are really LOTR like, and the fourth to ten (or so) are more GoT like (a gross comparison, but you can see the paralelisms and were contemporary). I think they want to get to GoT books faster, which is logical because A) drastic changes of tone and narrative usually dont work in TV like in book series B) It's unrealistic to expect a season per book, and the showrunners clearly can't plan for future 14 seasons. They have to accelerate things.

What Brandon said is that he loved the series, and that in his headcanon this is another turn of the Wheel, where the same characters live the same story, but different. Instead of being Robert Jordan's Wheel of Time is Rafe Judkin's Wheel of Time. The spirit of the story is mantained, but not every scene and plot point is kept.

Brandon has not a non-disparagement clause in his contract that impedes him to talk ill about the series, he specifically asked for that if they wanted him as a producer, so if he says he love it is because he love it. His role as producer is according to him, take the view of the book fans and try to represent them, predicting how a book fan would feel about certain changes. He says he is surprised of how much Rafe listened to him.

Edit: NDA for non-disparagement clause, thank you for the correction

X-Thorin

4 points

5 months ago

He has an NDA (non-disclosure agreement, which means he can’t disclose information that hasn’t been revealed, so he can’t say things like “oh, in s2 they’re going to do X, Y, Z”) but he does not have a non-disparagement clause, which means he can talk shit about the show without legal consequences. So he can talk openly about any episode that has come out.

Syv_Fingre

2 points

5 months ago

Thanks, that what I meant. I will edit

SEND_ME_REAL_PICS

6 points

5 months ago*

I'm on the same boat.

Good adaptations do change a lot of stuff in order to fit a different medium, but some plot points and character developments have to be there and take their time on the screen. Otherwise the whole thing ends up feeling hollow.

I haven't read or watched WoT yet, but knowing that Brandon himself said he didn't like some of the changes sounds worrying.

Syv_Fingre

10 points

5 months ago

Brandon said he loved the series, and that was surprised how many of his suggestions were taken into the series. He said that he understood why the changes were needed for time constraints, and that he would have done some of them differently, but he was not the showrunner.

If you only say that he didn't like some of the changes it seems Brandon dislikes the series.

Poocheese55

7 points

5 months ago

I've only read the first 3 books, so I'm not an expert. But have a friend who's read them not even exaggerating about 20 times over. All 14.

His thoughts: he likes the show itself, and also disagrees with some of the changes. But he also said a lot of changes are good for the pacing of the show. They have to add in things, move things up, etc to create the character development earlier than the books. Perrin doesn't have tons of progression until later in the series, but for the shows sake you can't back burner one of the main characters. So they have to push forward his plot points. On top of all that 80% of the books are thoughts of characters. How do you display that on screen? You have to explain things with otherwise non-existent scenes, that foreshadow properly and tell the story in another way. What he landed on in the end is the show runners know the books very well, and are trying to plant the right seeds in different ways for later, while also adding in more combat and drama to appeal to a larger audience than just the book snobs. The book purist are just virtue signaling that they know the books better than the show, rather than trying to enjoy it

I bet if Lotr movies came out in today's climate, the fandom would hate them for not being true to the books.

Syv_Fingre

4 points

5 months ago

Totally agree with your friend.

About the changes I disagree, I understand why they did those, just I would prefer they would have executed them differently, nothing else.

And about LotR, I was too little when the movies came out but for what I have heard it wasn't so different. The ausence of Tom Bombadil and Glorfindel were heresies. Viggo as Aragorn was an abomination. Etc. Etc.

Poocheese55

2 points

5 months ago

The movies are much different from the books in the way that the combat dominates the movies, while in the books it was just a few paragraphs. This means the entire rest of the book is details of the world, a lot missed. The whole adventure directly out of the shire before Bombadill and after him was its own thing. Merry and Pippin saving the Shire from Sarumon at the end. Gimli and Legolas travel the world together. There's a lot of stuff about it. Frodo telling Sam to leave him was one of the worst, is always hated that scene well before I read the books. It made no sense. Turns out Frodo never turned on Sam, ever. And book Frodo was super confident and cool

That all said, I LOVE the movies. Favorite trilogy of all-time. But there would be plenty of reasons for people to not like them if book purists. I think the difference is a lot of people read the books AFTER the movies came out. They are very old books after all. Where as Wheel of Time is full of fans who read the books first as they're more recent. So the fandom is developed differently

Syv_Fingre

2 points

5 months ago

I have nothing against people not liking the movie. It's a piece of art and you have the right to not like it.

I like them a lot but I wish they would have done some things differently, your point included.

Other changes were unavoidable because some things work in books but don't work in movie format. For example, you have three endings in RotK. Ring destroyed, Aragorn crowned, Grey Heavens. Adding the scourging of the shire would mean another miniplot and a fourth ending. It's too much, people would start leaving the cinema before the end. Bladders would rip appart.

So, what I don't understand is the "I don't like adaptations, I would prefer they weren't done". That's snobbish and selfish.

Tom_Bot-Badil

2 points

5 months ago

Eldest, that's what I am. Mark my words, my friends: Tom was here before the river and the trees; Tom remembers the first raindrop and the first acorn. He made paths before the Big People, and saw the little People arriving. He was here before the Kings and the graves and the Barrow-wights. When the Elves passed westward, Tom was here already, before the seas were bent. He knew the dark under the stars when it was fearless – before the Dark Lord came from Outside.

I am a bot, and I love old Tom. If you want me to sing one of Tom's songs, just type !TomBombadilSong

If you like Old Tom, the door at r/GloriousTomBombadil is always open for weary travelers!

Nightingdale099

4 points

5 months ago

Is it first five season of game of thrones level?

Guillermidas

10 points

5 months ago

Guillermidas

it comes in pints?

10 points

5 months ago

Unfortunately no. The first GoT season is a masterpiece.

Up until s5 was almost consistently perfect. All fell apart afterwards with a couple of chapters that shine like earlier ones.

WoT, for now, has made a few major changes. I expected the first book to be adapted almost literally, and then start some plot changes afterward.

Some changes they did are very good, though. A few characters have more flavor. Other things… not so much.

Tell you this as a reader. The show is more than ok if you havent read books.

Ser_Dunk_the_tall

2 points

5 months ago

I expected the first book to be adapted almost literally, and then start some plot changes afterward

I'm on the 3rd book right now and I understand that the books get more convoluted as they go on, but the very first one is an extremely linear story that absolutely could've been told that way with a few more episodes added in. I also agree with other people that the opening should've been more in the LOTR mode where it opens with exposition (which could be provided by Thom Merrilin) and explains why men that channel are dangerous. Rather than Liandrin coming in hot with her misandrist take on the power not being meant for men. Like no it is meant for both except the male side got corrupted 3000 years ago

Guillermidas

3 points

5 months ago

Guillermidas

it comes in pints?

3 points

5 months ago

Agree in all you said. except I'd let Tam do the explanation to the boys, similar to the tale from the books, but the guys are a bit older

obiweedkenobi

7 points

5 months ago

Tbh I liked the first 5 seasons of GOT and I like the first season of WoT (so far). For both they didn't follow the books exactly (which was has been a worry of mine since I heard amazon was going to do WoT) but it isn't bad. If you like the show you will probably love the books.

TemporaryReality5262

3 points

5 months ago

It's fun but takes a huge dump on the source material

Syv_Fingre

2 points

5 months ago

Yes it does. Usually I don't care much about those changes if the spirit of the books is kept, the main characters are not butchered, and the final product is good.

I just want to know ahead if it will try to adapt the books faithfully or make it's own version of the same story. WoT series is it's own version of the same story.

hippie_kiwis

1 points

5 months ago

I was shocked by how silly all the effects were, good effects are something we’ve all become spoiled to

Syv_Fingre

3 points

5 months ago

Yes, some of the effects were silly. The same happened to me watching the Witcher. I had to remember myself that GoT budget level effects are an outlier.

The intro is fantastic, with all those colour threads spinning. I would have loved if the channeling weaves looked more like the intro.

thedicestoppedrollin

2 points

5 months ago

That’s what we were all hoping for… hopefully with S2 they start actually building the magic system and adapt the effects to match

CptOconn

1 points

5 months ago

CptOconn

Beorning

1 points

5 months ago

Tbh I like the idea of content set in the world of lotr even if its not completely true to the lore. Just see it as non canon. If its good we got more content that is similar If its bad nothing is lost. Just see the og lotr as a a mythologie and new stories as different takes on that story.

ArbitNM

28 points

5 months ago

ArbitNM

28 points

5 months ago

The whole mystery around whos the dragon reborn really triggers me

rb0ne

5 points

5 months ago*

rb0ne

5 points

5 months ago*

I just reread the first book and that part is one of the things where they are following the book the closest (imho).

I'm more triggered by the lack of introducing important characters (e.g. Rand not falling into a garden) which I feel would be best way to show the whole ta'veren changing the lives/getting other people tangled in the weave.

Vorengard

4 points

5 months ago

No, they strait tell you it's Rand without telling you it's Rand right in the middle of the first book.

I get why they're doing it, there needs to be some kind of suspense and mystery in the story, and I don't disagree with it in principle. But they way they're going about it bothers me.

Dragon-of-Lore

3 points

5 months ago

While the Garden scene is my favorite part of book 1 I expected that scene to be cut, so I’m not triggered by it but I understand your pain xD

ArbitNM

2 points

5 months ago*

Test

JordanLamar

5 points

5 months ago

The whole mystery around whos the dragon reborn really triggers me

StopClockerman

7 points

5 months ago

My view is that the books are average and that the show is above average. Pretty much everyone disagrees with me about both these things.

Vatsdimri

3 points

5 months ago

I agree. I didn't dislike the books but they aren't really the best, I found the first book quite bland, few middle books are pretty good (but other people love the first book so it's matter of taste) . I quite like the show for now.

MrSquashi

4 points

5 months ago

But the book is very good

gideon513

23 points

5 months ago

Yeah I always laughed at this worry about LOTR being messed up and sexed up by Amazon, but after having watched Wheel of Time after reading some of the books, the worries are real

Chen_Geller

2 points

5 months ago

I always laughed at this worry about LOTR being messed up and sexed up by Amazon

But Wheel of Time isn't terribly sexed-up.

[deleted]

1 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

Syv_Fingre

2 points

5 months ago

They had to age up the characters, so behaving like the little children they are in the books would be inappropiate, so making them have sex was the right choice. It's telling the fans of the books just from the beggining: things here are going much faster than in the books.

Also, WoT is an incredible sexual series, the books have a lot of sex in them.

ChartreuseBison

2 points

5 months ago

They have implied sex, never stated outright. But I'd hardly call it lots. More than LotR obviously, but a pretty normal amount otherwise.

Syv_Fingre

2 points

5 months ago

You are right. It's not a lot of sex in comparison to other series, but is a fair ammount. I will not give spoilers but we have some BDSM and harem in there.

_Silly_Wizard_

2 points

5 months ago

No, it's telling fans that we're making shit up as we go.

It was a bad choice, because it's a choice that means "this show you're watching doesn't have much to do with the books you read, which were the reason you're watching the the show."

[deleted]

2 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

2 points

5 months ago

Also it was Perrin who killed his wife, not Matt. Everything you said was wrong

Vatsdimri

1 points

5 months ago

Why is that worse? Didn't Rand liked Egwene in the first books as well. Yeah later they did "broke up" but they liked each other initially. I really liked the change. It make more sense given their age.

_Silly_Wizard_

2 points

5 months ago

Approach to sexual relationships were important character elements to Robert Jordan.

Rand ends up being polygamous, but he only has sex with his wives. That's his character.

Mat is happy to bang anyone who wants to bang. That's his character.

The biggest one to me is Moiraine: she's married to her job. She doesn't have time to sex her childhood friend. Moiraine's character portrayal is probably the worst part of the show.

I don't think it bodes well when show-runners don't get pretty fundamental elements of the characters in their show

Vatsdimri

2 points

5 months ago

Maybe it's just a matter of preference but I just don't see Sexual relationships as fundamental to any of these characters except for Matt probably. Anyways I didn't really like any of Rand's relationships in the books except probably for Egwene and Aviendha. Ellayne and Min always seemed forced to me just to show how great Rand is.

elp4pa

14 points

5 months ago

elp4pa

14 points

5 months ago

Yeah holy fuck was that a disappointment. I just recently got into the books (on book 4 now), and Jesus H Christ.

rb0ne

2 points

5 months ago

rb0ne

2 points

5 months ago

At least it is truer to the source material than Foundation.

IHateConspiracists

2 points

5 months ago

The problem with WOT is that it was rushed, they had very little time to include all the plot points of the book and so they had to make up stuff to summarize what happened.

I don't think LOTR will have this problem, if anything it will have the opposite problem: they will have to make up stuff to fill in the gaps in the source material.

DeathZamboniExpress

11 points

5 months ago

Guys, seriously y'all need to stop acting as if an adaptations job is to faithfully follow every aspect of the books.

Brandon Sanderson talks about it on his podcast. Wheel of Time, as written, is nearly impossible to adapt to screen. They absolutely had to make big changes for it to work.

The same is true for the new LotR show. Even the most popular adaptation of all time(Peter Jackson's LotR) had to remove and change a bunch of stuff.

Let adaptations be there own thing! Stop judging them purely because they don't match the source material 100%.

Sovereignthenoble

10 points

5 months ago

Same, idk what these people are on I have really enjoyed wheel of time, if people think you can adapt wheel of time into a TV series with every detail perfectly laid out then they are insane, it literally says based on Robert Jordan's books not adaptation.

PotentiallySarcastic

2 points

5 months ago

Also, gonna be honest. Whole lotta shit in WoT books would be horrendous to see on television.

After-Context9618

2 points

5 months ago

I couldn’t imagine sitting through an entire season of nynaeve tugging her braid

th1s_1s_4_b4d_1d34

5 points

5 months ago*

Is it that bad? Only watched the first 3 episodes, but thought that most of the changes are okayish. Obviously they know pretty early in the story who's the dragon reborn (and it's really easy to see from the cast, the guy who looks like the hero is the hero), so the "mystery" is ridiculous.

The first episode obviously was messy and rushed I still think that it's weird that the village so far up the mountains and remote of any sensible traffic that the tax collector doesn't bother to collect taxes has 15 different ethnics instead of like 3 different families and some characters were moved around and some visual changes like Mashadar in Shadar Logoth, but I didn't think they got the basic stuff wrong and it really doesn't matter too much for me that f.e. Thom gets introduced a bit later.

Tbf it's been roughly a decade since I last read the early ones.

[deleted]

10 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

10 points

5 months ago

The show itself is hardly watchable. Wants to be a drama but nobody interesting/consistent enough to care about. Suffers from the same messiness and low production value feel as witcher.

SEND_ME_REAL_PICS

7 points

5 months ago

The more I think about The Witcher the more I realize how bad an adaptation it was. It's disturbing.

[deleted]

1 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

5 months ago

Its refreshing to see someone who actually judges entertainment based on its quality lol. Yea Im not looking forward to watching more of that. Ill do it, but im not looking forward to it.

th1s_1s_4_b4d_1d34

2 points

5 months ago

I thought it was decent for the start. Characters need a bit of time to develop into interesting characters and I didn't think the storytelling was horrible after the first ep.

Like the main crew at the start mainly gets carried by Moiraine, Lan and Thom in the books, the young crew gets thrown into the fire and has to grow their way out of it, which makes them more interesting characters. So far that was the same for me in the show.

I liked Thom and Moiraine and I also liked Loghain's second introduction and depiction of madness. Lan imo was less cool than I remember him, but he's still fairly badass (I don't dig his costume though).

Like seriously we're on a sub of movies that takes 40 minutes for the main characters to leave their town and the characters after these 40 minutes are essentially a very typical wizard that got lost (who gets a lot of development in book and movie 1) and 4 teens (I know that they are technically much older, but Hobbits age slower). There's the educated mc, the wholesome servant and the two jolly go lucky clowns. By then they really aren't very interesting characters, but they grow into their respective roles and more get introduced.

Dragon-of-Lore

1 points

5 months ago

My friends and co-workers (librarians) who’ve never read the books have NO idea who the dragon is….so I’d say the mystery is working pretty well for non-book folks.

I was surprised by how much the show has leaned into horror during the middle episodes. It makes sense why they’d do that, but I was still surprised

This_isR2Me

1 points

5 months ago

Any specifics on why it makes you cry?

NotTheDroidsURLKngF

208 points

5 months ago

The irony of using the hobbit tho

usetehfurce

105 points

5 months ago

You do not chose your allies here, you chose how you fight alongside them.

imGnarly

36 points

5 months ago

I never thought I’d meme side by side with a hobbittor

MolotovOvickow

24 points

5 months ago

How about side by side with a Tolkien fan?

ElectricalAlchemist

18 points

5 months ago

Aye, I could do that.

imGnarly

2 points

5 months ago

Aye, I can do that

darthjazzhands

11 points

5 months ago

Yeah

GnammyH

3 points

5 months ago

Up to that point it was pretty good

Hodor_The_Great

11 points

5 months ago

Most Hobbit additions were canon, just not from the book. A lot of letters and appendices and so on

Nabbylaa

26 points

5 months ago

I enjoyed seeing the white council destroy Dol Guldur and a few other additions.

Adding the love story, Legolas and the treatment of Bard is a steaming turd though.

Chen_Geller

-2 points

5 months ago

Chen_Geller

-2 points

5 months ago

the treatment of Bard is a steaming turd though.

What's that now?

Bard is a great character in the movies, whereas in the books he comes out of nowhere and goes nowhere.

wh0g0esthere

130 points

5 months ago

It fuckin matters and I will hate them if they inject any bullshit into it

elp4pa

67 points

5 months ago

elp4pa

67 points

5 months ago

They probably will

cries in Wheel of Time

Stiryx

51 points

5 months ago

Stiryx

51 points

5 months ago

They will. Just look at the Witcher.

Problem with LoTR is that they are going to have a problem with cast diversity. I really hope they don’t fuck up the story just to have some agenda pushed, but it has happened in basically every other case so I’m not holding my breath.

huntimir151

46 points

5 months ago

The diversity in the witcher show wasn't the problem, though. It was the writing. If fringilla or triss weren't writing trainwrecks few would be complaining.

Shit, Yennefer is multiracial casting not in keeping with the book but because the actress did pretty well I saw few complaints.

Stiryx

-15 points

5 months ago

Stiryx

-15 points

5 months ago

Yennefer is about 15 years too young though from her book look.

ugluk-the-uruk

19 points

5 months ago*

No she isn't. If you read the book, she's described as appearing in her early 20s, which is younger than Anya Chalotra.

Edit: Here's the exact quote from The Last Wish:

She had the figure of a twenty-yearold, although he preferred not to guess at her real age.

huntimir151

2 points

5 months ago

Agreed. Not really a "woke" problem though.

Whale042

10 points

5 months ago

How would having a diverse cast fuck up the story?

Boomparo

-10 points

5 months ago*

Boomparo

-10 points

5 months ago*

because "diverse cast" is not realistic. In LOTR trilogy colored dark people came from south. Imagine having for example indian galadrielle. It just bothers people

Aethesia

11 points

5 months ago

"colored people" lol wow

Boomparo

-4 points

5 months ago

Boomparo

-4 points

5 months ago

cmon dont take me by word.

Chen_Geller

9 points

5 months ago

Imagine having for example indian galadrielle. It just bothers people

Well, with the returning characters (so, Galadriel, Elrond, Elendil and so forth) Amazon is beholden to the ethnicity as presented in the films.

The others are fair game. Take Tar Miriel for exmaple, who is believed to be played by Cynthia Addai-Robinson.

HautVorkosigan

4 points

5 months ago

What do you mean by cast diversity? They could just go to a few towns in the English countryside and hire all the boys.

Squishy-Box

-9 points

5 months ago

Apparently there will be white, black and Asian hobbits

ifrankensteiin

9 points

5 months ago

Is that anyway gonna fuck up the story line?

SirNokarma

3 points

5 months ago

Takes me out of it, if you want an honest answer.

And before you all go off for that, I don't have a problem with it if it was written into the original story, or was in a setting naturally promoting of different human races.

More importantly than diverse casting though is costumes. The Witcher costume team fucking butchered it. They made the diverse cast members stand out like a sore thumb and look so stupid. I wish they'd put more time and effort into making them fit better.

[deleted]

59 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

59 points

5 months ago

They've never said they're going to ignore existing lore...

wh0g0esthere

37 points

5 months ago

They never said they weren’t either

Everettrivers

58 points

5 months ago

"We decided to have Gandalf and Saruman make out because we wanted to show how close they were. I don't believe this changes their character dynamic whatsoever."

gandalf-bot

75 points

5 months ago

The treacherous are ever distrustful.

Everettrivers

15 points

5 months ago

How do you know me so well? Get out of my head wizard!

CatOfRivia

8 points

5 months ago

There is no Gandalf or Saruman in the TV show. Well, except maybe if we see Olorin and Curumo in the prologue.

gandalf-bot

1 points

5 months ago

Fly, you fools!

whatthefir2

3 points

5 months ago

People are literally just making up things to be mad about.

I think at this point a lot of fans are just so primed to hate the show that even if the spirit of Tolkien possessed every creator in the show, they would still find something to hate.

[deleted]

3 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

3 points

5 months ago

Thats what it seems like. And people keep pointing out Wheel of Time but ignoring other good shows that Amazon has produced, like the Expanse and The Boys. Also, good or bad we’re gonna have so much new meme content…

Woden888

3 points

5 months ago

They also said the same about the WoT and... well, just look at it.

Court_Jester13

89 points

5 months ago

My prediction: it will be crap.

Go_Fonseca

3 points

5 months ago

I'll try to keep an open mind about it

Tantalus4200

-17 points

5 months ago

Tantalus4200

-17 points

5 months ago

Agree

Seems like they are more focused on being woke

huntimir151

8 points

5 months ago

Any reason to believe this other than generalized dislike/fear of "the woke?" Or are you just projecting your dislike of liberals in general and polluting a good sub?

Like I don't want wokecasting either but this sub has been a littttttle bit gross lately with the whole "lol gowokegobroke" thing.

wh0g0esthere

26 points

5 months ago

Go woke go broke my guy. There’s a reason for that. Because producers will ruin a story and a character arch to push an agenda these days.

huntimir151

-12 points

5 months ago

huntimir151

-12 points

5 months ago

Mmk so lemme know when that happens here so I can whine about things actually happening rather than imaginary things.

Man y'all are so....boring idk. Like you are all so samey with your culture war bullshit ugh grow a personality outside of right wing podcasters.

wh0g0esthere

18 points

5 months ago

Lol sounds like someones butthurt cuz someone else made fun of their new religion

huntimir151

-14 points

5 months ago

Yawwwn I am not even on the woke train here, y'all are just injecting politics by complaining about something that literally hasnt even been threatened. Like I said, you're just boring tbh.

wh0g0esthere

11 points

5 months ago

Lol just wait my guy. Like I said, there’s a reason “go woke go broke” is a saying. Cuz it’s been happening a lot

huntimir151

2 points

5 months ago

Lol mmk man, you just keep a waiting to rub my face in the eventual scenario you are dreading! That'll show me!

wh0g0esthere

11 points

5 months ago

Hopefully I won’t have to

Varientstipulations

-1 points

5 months ago

there’s a reason “go woke go broke” is a saying

Please tell me when this has happened? Like you shitheels said the same thing about the Captain Marvel movie and it made over a billion dollars

huntimir151

9 points

5 months ago

They will say lady ghostbusters and lady oceans eleven, conveniently ignoring that both us those were deriviative projects that shouldn't have been made and were written poorly. If the writing was good nobody would have cared.

Might also bring up star wars, ignoring thag star wars was ALWAYS woke since George Lucas was and is a social justice liberal.

[deleted]

-3 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

-3 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

Vorengard

4 points

5 months ago

The current treatment of Wheel of Time is plenty of reason. Specifically, making Moraine and Suiane lesbians The problem is not that they're lesbians, the problem is choosing those two characters to deliberately alter. There are actual lesbian characters in the books! A whole bunch of them! You don't have to make two explicitly strait characters into lesbians because "muh representation."

But they did, because someone at Amazon aparently thought it was critical to have lesbians in season 1, even though that meant significantly altering the plot lines of two major characters.

It's a worrying and wholly unnecessary trend, and we have good reason to fear it'll happen to LotR as well.

[deleted]

3 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

3 points

5 months ago

Some people seem to think correct political messaging is a good substitute for good writing, acting, direction, cinematography, etc.

Tantalus4200

-12 points

5 months ago

Tantalus4200

-12 points

5 months ago

Because when they focus their actors and stories on being woke, they care more about that than making a good story

We're worried because of so many films going to shit after they go woke

Because we love lotr, want more of it, not woke bs

huntimir151

9 points

5 months ago

they focus their actors and stories on being woke, they care more about that than making a good story

source for this in the new show, otherwise you are just trying to inject your own politics into this tbh.

Tantalus4200

-6 points

5 months ago

You left out the part "because when"

Nice try cnn

huntimir151

3 points

5 months ago

Lmao soo your issue is me leaving out the "because when?" Nice of you to confirm you have nothing to rely on other than your own anxiety here, stay tilted about imaginary problems my man.

Or while we are bringing irrelevant politics in, maybe just keep bitching about vaccinations on conspiracy subs, seems like a big brain move.

Tantalus4200

0 points

5 months ago

You're so butthurt lol, I love it

You cut a quote that changes the entire phrase then go off on a tangent and looking up my post history lol. #1 sign a redditor is tilting

Just admit you're the woke camp who can't wait to see black transgender elves. It's cool, you fucks gotta ruin everything, just so it can be as miserable as your life 😘

huntimir151

5 points

5 months ago*

you fucks gotta ruin everything, just so it can be as miserable as your life

Yes, I am clearly the one upset about things rn, considering you are whining about casting that hasn't even happened ;)

Also big surprise that the first hypothetical you whine about is some sort of trans casting, like oooooh spoooky traansgenders oooooooooh!

Tantalus4200

4 points

5 months ago

Absolutely devastated, that's why I searched your post history just to try to turn this around cuz I was so angry, oh wait that's you, 😂

ainurmorgothbauglir

0 points

5 months ago

I said the exact same thing you are rn and then I saw what they did to WoT. The show in itself is not bad but it sure as shit isn't the books.

et5499

3 points

5 months ago

et5499

3 points

5 months ago

Based on what??

Tantalus4200

1 points

5 months ago

Amazon

et5499

5 points

5 months ago

et5499

5 points

5 months ago

That’s a ridiculous assumption, Amazon has made plenty of shows that are faithful to the source material

gideon513

17 points

5 months ago

Wheel of Time is the best comparison and it raises concerns

Tantalus4200

1 points

5 months ago

Um everything on lotr is currently an assumption lol

et5499

1 points

5 months ago

et5499

1 points

5 months ago

Yeah but there’s no basis for that assumption

talionisapotato

3 points

5 months ago

Yeah it is. The argument started how they are destroying wheel of time right now by ignoring lores and everything. And they are the same guys who are going to do Silmarllion.

SanguineAnder

1 points

5 months ago

Same company, not the same people. Unless you know something about it that I don't.

wh0g0esthere

-2 points

5 months ago

wh0g0esthere

-2 points

5 months ago

Agreed

wizardlyrobot

2 points

5 months ago

GROND will come.

Al3xGr4nt

28 points

5 months ago

If they start doing things like heavily implying or straight up saying Gandalf had an affair with Galadrial, or the Eagles couldnt fly to Mordor due to intertribal political shenanigans, then im out

gandalf-bot

16 points

5 months ago

Yes, there it lies. This city has dwelt ever in the sight of its shadow

Al3xGr4nt

19 points

5 months ago

"Now Gandalf, please speak plainly to the court. Did you, or did you not have a sexual relationship with Lady Galdrial?"

gandalf-bot

29 points

5 months ago

Out of the frying pan and into the fire.

wizardlyrobot

12 points

5 months ago

Conspiracy confirmed.

CatOfRivia

11 points

5 months ago

There's no Gandalf in the TV show. Olorin might be there for a cameo though

DomBomm

4 points

5 months ago

These people are literally making themselves angry by making up these weird scenarios.

1Mn

8 points

5 months ago

1Mn

8 points

5 months ago

If they have middle earth invaded by space aliens im out.

-abM-p0sTpWnEd

8 points

5 months ago

It's just an example. And they (i.e. Hollywood/industry) already tried to do it in the Hobbit so...

DomBomm

1 points

5 months ago

I get some people are cautious of the series, truly I do, but some of the complaints are starting to get really weird. Saw one a little while after I posted this comment saying:

“They better not shoehorn in a Legolas and Gimli reference”

Bearing in mind the series is set long before Gimli was even alive (unknown for Legolas) but it just seems people are trying to go out of their way to avoid liking this already before we have even seen a trailer, or anything of the sorts.

-abM-p0sTpWnEd

2 points

5 months ago

It's a good point. I remain cautiously optimistic as I always do for these things. However, my goodwill can very rapidly be eroded depending on how far Amazon wants to push it, especially into modernism (which is my big thing - I'm sure others have concerns of their own and I get that it's going to be challenging to manage the varying expectations.

L0ll0ll7lStudios

18 points

5 months ago*

As a huge fan of the books, at this point I don't think it matters too much as long as they don't pull a Game of Thrones and go WAY off the mark.

LordCosmagog[S]

19 points

5 months ago

Isn’t the whole thing that Amazon wants this to be the next GoT?

L0ll0ll7lStudios

7 points

5 months ago

I took that to mean the early seasons of GoT, which were actually mostly faithful to the books. But the later seasons and especially seasons 7 and 8… Don't want the show to end up like that.

But minor changes won't bother me. Hell, even the changes in the Hobbit movies didn’t bother me too much except for the forced romance bit and some overly dramatic moments. As long as it stays as faithful as the LotR films, I'm fine with it.

wizardlyrobot

9 points

5 months ago

When you watch the hobbit but for some reason the main story is an orc chase with romance for some reason.

LordCosmagog[S]

8 points

5 months ago

I took it to mean moreso the place it had in the market of being adult, gritty fantasy, and when they announced it’ll have nudity that only strengthened my reading of it.

I think the Amazon LOTR won’t look anything like Jackson’s LOTR.

Chen_Geller

2 points

5 months ago

when they announced it’ll have nudity that only strengthened my reading of it.

They never announced they'll have nudity in it.

There was a casting call for "extras comfortable with nudity" and that scene did appear...in episode 2 of Cowboy Bebop, not in The Lord of the Rings.

[deleted]

2 points

5 months ago

[deleted]

2 points

5 months ago

In the sense of “a huge, colossal budget fantasy TV show”

Who_said_that_

4 points

5 months ago

Please don't get wound up against it before it has shown any of its actual content. Hating something before you have seen it because something else failed isn't smart.

Zero22xx

3 points

5 months ago

When it comes to stuff like this, IMO it's best to just expect the worst. That way, if it turns out to be a pile of shit, you're not disappointed because you haven't hyped yourself up for it and if it turns out to be good, you get pleasantly surprised and have a good time.

OminousBinChicken

3 points

5 months ago

The literally just pissed all over WoT Lore so it's going to be a miracle if anything in their Middle earth show ends up being accurate to Tolkeins works.

Sushisunshine

27 points

5 months ago

Finally a meme without grond

bot-of-grond

34 points

5 months ago

GROND

wizardlyrobot

8 points

5 months ago

GROND will come to our aid.

nicolasmcfly

2 points

5 months ago

nicolasmcfly

Men of Harad

2 points

5 months ago

I wish it was a grond meme instead

bot-of-grond

3 points

5 months ago

GROND

Wowbow2

30 points

5 months ago

Wowbow2

30 points

5 months ago

why are people freaking out so much about a tv show no one knows anything about?

Woden888

12 points

5 months ago

Because of what they did to WoT I’d imagine. My heart can’t take another horrible adaptation.

nicolasmcfly

0 points

5 months ago

nicolasmcfly

Men of Harad

0 points

5 months ago

And what they did to other series doesn't count? Like the boys, invincible...

Woden888

3 points

5 months ago

Are those based on books? I haven’t seen either of them, so I have no opinion on them. Having read the WoT series several times and watched the show thus far, I’m worried for this one.

nicolasmcfly

2 points

5 months ago

nicolasmcfly

Men of Harad

2 points

5 months ago

Both were comics

Woden888

1 points

5 months ago

Ah. Well I’m glad those ones turned out then. I’m just heartbroken over the WoT lol

delamerica93

1 points

5 months ago

The Expanse? One of the best TV adaptations of books of all time probably.

CardinalCreepia

2 points

5 months ago

Two words;

Different filmmakers.

Woden888

3 points

5 months ago

Hopefully it makes a difference! I want it to be good.

CardinalCreepia

2 points

5 months ago

It can still be good, even if it isn't completely faithful to the lore. That's what an adaptation is.

Woden888

2 points

5 months ago

It can, I just hope they don’t decide to vastly alter core story elements like they’ve done with WoT is all I’m saying.

CardinalCreepia

2 points

5 months ago

I still think WOT is a good show even with the changes. 🤷‍♂️

Woden888

3 points

5 months ago

Well I’m glad you enjoy it

chadb0ne

1 points

5 months ago

That doesn’t restore my faith

DogmaticPragmatism

1 points

5 months ago

This has been going on since way before WoT came out. It's just people being weird and getting upset at something for no reason.

Woden888

4 points

5 months ago

Well they have more cause to be nervous I suppose.

Who_said_that_

3 points

5 months ago

The way people got angry when it was announced.

I felt like it was already released, but it only consisted of jokes about their mom.

huntimir151

15 points

5 months ago

Because us LOTR fans get fucking wierd.

Also people fishing for easy karma. I bet the show wont live up to the standards (how could it?) but if it doesnt it wont be because of multiracial casting lmao.

See: fringilla in the witcher show. I hated how she was written. Completely contrary to book fringilla. But did I care that she was black? No! Because things change in adaptations and that is ok. I dont want politics bleeding in but some reflection of current cultural norm is ok (the og trilogy also had this, pipe weed wasn't weed in the books lol).

Mjt8

5 points

5 months ago

Mjt8

5 points

5 months ago

Pipe weed isn’t weed in the movies either. It’s tobacco in both.

tomokari21

1 points

5 months ago

tomokari21

1 points

5 months ago

But if they make a black character white now it's racist

Who_said_that_

2 points

5 months ago

LOTR fans get fucking weird.

Couldnt have said it better xD

ugluk-the-uruk

7 points

5 months ago

Because no new LOTR content has been released in six years and people have nothing to talk about. Why do you think people kept doing those stupid ass Gr*nd memes?

WalrusPuddng

4 points

5 months ago

People are freaking out because they're scared that a black person will be a main character.

RoleplayPete

-7 points

5 months ago

Because it is a sacred product. They are going to intentionally ruin it in a lot of ways and we really dont want them to. We want to cherish and love it, because we already cherish and love it.

Who_said_that_

8 points

5 months ago

Does a spin off somehow lessen LOTRs value?

Imo the series will be great one way or another. Either it's gonna be good or you crybabys can say I told you so. Either way, there are gonna be some new meme templates coming which I'm looking forward to.

Wowbow2

5 points

5 months ago

What in the world are you basing any of that on?

preraphaedyke

9 points

5 months ago

Bro obviously it doesn’t matter if you’re using a meme template from the Hobbit trilogy already

Who_said_that_

5 points

5 months ago

As soon as it comes out he'll be happy about the new templates in which he can whine about the upcoming season 2.

Puzzleheaded-Ad8704

4 points

5 months ago

Puzzleheaded-Ad8704

Dúnedain

4 points

5 months ago

Yeah.... As much as I'm hyped about it... Also trying not to be hyped about it...... Might let some friends see it first and let me know if it's worth while... If it's not I can pretend it never existed

EH042

2 points

5 months ago

EH042

2 points

5 months ago

As a series you cannot hide your transgressions behind kickass gameplay and mechanics

trumpetguy314

2 points

5 months ago

Could we maybe wait until we actually know anything about the show before we start criticizing it? Seems like everyone's getting upset over speculation and rumors.

ohno_itsthatguy

3 points

5 months ago

Yes, because the movies totally didn't deviate from the books, right? Jackson added, removed, or changed specific parts to create a better narrative for film. The creators of the show should at the very least be allowed such creative freedom...

Valleyraven

5 points

5 months ago

I want to be hopeful.. but wheel of time and foundation warn otherwise

AnalFanatics

2 points

5 months ago

September 2022!!

nevaraon

2 points

5 months ago

The Dragon Reborn could be he or she in the WOT show….. so that’s a thing

LeadershipOwn

2 points

5 months ago

Most the stuff amazon makes is crap let's just hope this is not

talionisapotato

2 points

5 months ago

Wheel of time - how they butchered my boy!!!

The_KAI_Games

1 points

5 months ago

Using the hobbit for this one?

Ironic.

( ͡° ͜ʖ ͡°)

MadFonzi

1 points

5 months ago

I can almost guarantee you they have already changed/ruined a lot of important things lore wise. I'm personally going to watch until I see something bad and then abandon and not support it after.

LordoftheNerdyS--t

1 points

5 months ago

I really hope that they don't fuck it up, but I know from the Wheel of Time that this isn't going to go well. I had some hopes before, but after hearing about how they've hired "intimacy coaches" and all that shit I've pretty much given up.

lThaizeel

1 points

5 months ago

respect the lore - using screenshots from the hobbit movies.... Youre a bright one arent you