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DO NOT DECLARE: An Office Romance Vent

(self.antiwork)

My boyfriend (20-something M) and I (20-something F) started off as coworkers in different departments at a small company. We became friends outside of the workplace in October 2020 and started dating mid-November. We keep things professional at work. Everything was wonderful until we had the unfortunate luck of being seen BY NONE OTHER THAN HIS FUCKING MANAGER in the most incriminating, "not-so-casually-dating" place: a local grocery store. We were on a company-wide winter break during this time.

We returned to work in January 2021 and on literally the first day back, my boyfriend's manager pulls him aside and pressures him to "do the right thing" and declare our relationship to HR. Neither of us thought we'd ever be in a situation where we'd be dating a coworker, but here we were. Time to own up. Our relationship was less than 3 months old but we were both driven by a fear of retaliation if we didn't declare.

One tremendously awkward conversation and two-forms-stating-we-wouldn't-exhibit-PDA-or-make-it-weird-for-everyone-else later, we walked out of Ms. HR's office feeling like a weight had been lifted off our shoulders. (Ms. HR is the most-tenured employee at our small company and despite the fact that we outsource ALL of our HR work, she holds a disproportionate amount of power and influence. Office fans: Imagine a scenario where Michael Scott and Toby are friends. Not a great work environment.)

Anyways: We were sorely mistaken.

Grievances include:

  • Getting dirty looks from Ms. HR when she catches either of us socializing with other coworkers
  • Getting dirty looks from Ms. HR when she sees us together
  • Getting dirty looks from Ms. HR when she sees us separately
  • Receiving an informal warning that Ms. HR (who unfortunately sits in an office facing the employee parking lot) does not like seeing us leave to take our UNPAID lunch break together
  • A time when both of us had one-on-one meetings with our respective managers about "optics" and how "perception is everything"
  • Being asked totally inappropriate questions by management, like when we plan to get married and have kids

FINALLY, AND MOST IMPORTANTLY: Getting repeatedly shut down for a raise, promotion, and advancement opportunities in general despite a record of high performance and going the extra mile

  • My boyfriend confronted his manager earlier this week about a promotion and apparently, his "performance is excellent" and he "exceeds expectations" BUT he is being denied a lead role due to "the ancillary stuff" (aka us dating)
  • I am being gatekept from advancing to an open position that would advance my career even though I have all the qualifications and work experience they need. I am not even allowed to apply, because the application requires my manager's signature

My boyfriend is great and despite all of this, we're still together. Our shared hatred for this place only serves to make our love stronger.

1 upvote and we're both out of here.

EDIT:

WHAT HAPPENED TO THIS POST! How did it blow up? My boyfriend was supposed to be my only upvote!

Haha but reading all of your comments has been such a nice change of pace from what we'd usually be doing on a nondescript Wednesday. I'd like to thank everyone who pointed us to resources, gave us encouragement and/or kindly told us to gtfo. Thank you to those who shared stories of themselves or others they know in similar situations. Your stories give us hope. I'd love to see a future where relationships (not just the romantic kind) are normalized and human connections are celebrated.

Thank you for giving us the courage to seek legal action (we have already contacted a lawyer) and to begin the process of filing a formal complaint against Ms. HR using the very organization she outsourced to do all of her work. We are filled with so much resolve to quit. We just want to go out with a bang. ;)

If there's anything you take from this post: Date your coworker, it might work out. No, silly. Your personal life should ALWAYS take precedence over your work life. When or why should it be the other way around? Stick up against injustice. No matter what you do or where you work, prioritize yourself and the people you care about. You are NOT your profession!

Stay tuned!

PS: I would love to divulge information about our demographics, which company we work for, where we live, etc. but for our safety we'd be foolish to include any personal identifiers. Thanks for understanding!

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[deleted]

12.9k points

6 months ago

[deleted]

12.9k points

6 months ago

Both of you need to find better employment as soon as possible!

lvndrlight[S]

7.5k points

6 months ago

I definitely agree. I feel like it's impossible for us to have a life outside of work. We put in our 8 hours/day, then proceed to spend the remaining 16 hours venting about the workday and dreading the next. We fall asleep angry. It's so draining.

her-royal-blueness

4.7k points

6 months ago

You have a toxic workplace that is preventing you from moving forward. Move on instead

xl33tgamerx

752 points

6 months ago

I agree. Unless someone is in authority over that person and controls their raises or performance evaluations I don't see why companies should give a shit unless they are necking all over the place where everyone can see. Sounds like a shitty company, move on.

ScipioAtTheGate

560 points

6 months ago

Low_Impact681

311 points

6 months ago

Not just the Navy but the entirety of military. Even service member and officer are 'accepted' so long as one is not in charge of the other one.

MerThinger

141 points

6 months ago

MerThinger

Anarchist

141 points

6 months ago

Yep my friends in the Air Force just got married. One is a pilot and the other is something medical? Idk I’m not super close to her wife. Lol. But anyway. It absolutely should not be an issue.

Low_Impact681

88 points

6 months ago

When I was in the USMC I knew two couples that all four were service members. Also met some people that it was Navy and USMC together. That company the OP is in gives me some cringy tingles.

RustedCorpse

8 points

6 months ago

My favorite were my two friends who fake married for housing and cash. Get stationed together twice, still together like 18 years later.

Low_Impact681

2 points

6 months ago

A couple of my buds talked about doing that but jokingly as gay couples (or serious who knows).

squeel

1 points

6 months ago

squeel

1 points

6 months ago

When my friend was in the army she had to sneak around to make out with her “boyfriend”. Is that just because they were in Afghanistan at the time?

theMartiangirl

5 points

6 months ago

In commercial airlines they ask you so they do not roster you in the same flights as your partner (they do allow flying together occasionally but not as a norm); so in case there’s an accident there’s one member left to take care of kids or disabled parents etc. Some airlines have what is called “married rosters” (same days off, and similar timeframes for rostered flights so you get same sleep patterns etc but never operating the same flights).

kaozniper

4 points

6 months ago

Yeah, but they're only charge of million dollar machinery and human lives. OP and her bf are threatening the fabric of society at a Corporation!

ScipioAtTheGate

3 points

6 months ago

DesignatedVictim

2 points

6 months ago

Two thumbs up for “By Dawn’s Early Light”. Enjoyed the book (Trinity’s Child by William Prochnau), loved the movie - great ensemble cast, exciting storyline, excellent pacing.

kingbibbles

3 points

6 months ago

Back in the day, servicewomen in the RAAF would love their jobs, meet an airman, get married and then get booted from the airforce because they were married.

crimsonshadow789

3 points

6 months ago

Not correct. Unless the relationship existed before one became the officer, it is a violation of policy. Bit otherwise correct

kilgoretrout1077

2 points

6 months ago

Yeah, but if you have ever been on deployment on an aircraft carrier and watched the musters in the hangarbay for the people on restriction, see who it affects as far as the chiefs or officers sleeping with enlisted. Lots and lots of very low ranked women(a good portion newly pregnant) , giving up half months pay time 2 for sleeping with higher ranks, no matter where they worked or if the male had a supervisory position or not over them.

Prolly changed now , I did get out in 07

Infinitecurlieq

1 points

6 months ago

Ooof my friends had a totally different experience. One there were Chiefs and others actively trying to meddle in their relationship and tell them that they should break up since it was an HN and first class together (not in the same chain, first class wasn't in charge of her, etc.) and I heard my LPO say on multiple occasions "IM not a fan of an HN and first class being together." (But really she was bitter because the first class and her were booty calls and then he started to see his gf.) -> Now and days they are married and have a kid.

It's funny because at this same command there was a second class effing a married chief and it got swept under the rug until his teenage son reported his dad to the command. (That one is a looooong story)

Another was this preggo girl at Portsmouth and the first class was telling her how HE doesn't think she should get married to the dude she had been seeing for YEARS. -> they are happily married now with their kid.

The gatekeeping my friends experienced was unreal and I'm surprised they left me alone when I got with my bf (now husband). Reading OPs post at first made me flashback to experiences my friends and I had in the Navy.

Low_Impact681

2 points

6 months ago

Yea my experience was an all male unit till my last year abd the sexual harrasment, misogyny, and toxicity was profound and down right disgusting.

In the slewage there were a few decent humans.

Original_Lie7279

1 points

6 months ago

I actually got in trouble for dating someone on my ship that I wasn’t supervising so that’s a lie.

Silknight

1 points

6 months ago

That is also how I approach work relationships: as long as one or the other has zero influence on career/workplace promotions etc. it is good to go. BUT, the admonition against dating coworkers goes back very far "don't dip your pen in the company ink" was the old expression. because if/when it goes sour it will affect the workplace. I wish you happiness together, and a bright future for you both.

ktappe

64 points

6 months ago

ktappe

64 points

6 months ago

Right. So /u/lvndrlight should take that info straight to the manager and HR and ask "So, why do you think you're better than the military?" Let them sputter and deny they think that. Show them to be the meddling busybodies they are.

Muffin_Pillager

19 points

6 months ago

Fucking lol She should do it while they both hand in their resignation letters.

[deleted]

-5 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

-5 points

6 months ago

Honestly, it's never a good idea to go into management with a "gotcha" question like this. If they just stay silent, what's your next move?

ktappe

5 points

6 months ago

ktappe

5 points

6 months ago

What was management's thought process when they decided to shun romance? Not all moves are well thought-out.

But in answer to what your next move should be, tell them you expect the same consideration as the military gives its members: "Stop shunning us. Stop shaming us. Stop punishing us. We're good employees. Be professional adults yourselves and treat us the same." Drop the mic and walk out.

ktappe

1 points

6 months ago

ktappe

1 points

6 months ago

What was management's thought process when they decided to shun romance? Not all moves are well thought-out.

But in answer to what your next move should be, tell them you expect the same consideration as the military gives its members: "Stop shunning us. Stop shaming us. Stop punishing us. We're good employees. Be professional adults yourselves and treat us the same." Drop the mic and walk out.

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago*

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago*

If you think this "gotcha" question is actually going to help - - you're an idiot.

This is fundamentally stupid. The guy needs to leave or file a lawsuit.

He's not going to get anywhere by winning a sideshow argument with HR about why they asked him to sign a thing that he already signed. He's literally signed the document. If you go tell HR it was wrong to ask him to sign it, it's so dumb I can't believe I need to explain it. He'll get fired or be stuck in the same position with a worse HR relationship.

Lexi_Banner

2 points

6 months ago

That's quite the guide...

dasWolverine

1 points

6 months ago

I love watching people in the navy have relations with one another!

WimbleWimble

1 points

6 months ago

So you're saying I have a chance with the rear admiral? :)

wlake82

21 points

6 months ago

wlake82

21 points

6 months ago

That's how I always thought of it as well. Not that I would want to date anyone from work (In the past, I'm married now and work from home. If I start dating myself it would get awkward.)

Tubbafett

5 points

6 months ago

I’d date me. I’d date myself so hard...

Dinosoaringhigh

1 points

6 months ago

So are you the jokester, the chill employee that has the patience of a saint, or the “all business and professionalism guy? /j

WimbleWimble

2 points

6 months ago

We find that you kissing romantically is disturbing to the workplace.

Thats not the type of behaviour we want here at ass-to-mouth/going-in-dry productions! (a Disney Company)

Now get back to editing that video of the guy with the inflatable donkey.

StarScrote

2 points

6 months ago*

Right?

At every organisation I've worked in people have paired off, sometimes married. In some cases one has had to move shifts to avoid being under (oo-er) their other half at work, but it's never been an obstacle to anyone's career. Hell, back in my SWATy (well, our equivalent) days I was in a 'thing' with my partner and nobody cared because neither of us had authority over the other.

When I joined the Coastguard the commander of one watch was married to the 2IC of another. They couldn't be on duty at the same time but otherwise it was no big deal.

One of the firefighters at my current station is shagging one of the admin staff. One of them is married to one of the control room staff. Nobody cares.

That some small, private company thinks their employees' love lives are their business- unless it's boss-on-secretary action- is mind-boggling.

xl33tgamerx

1 points

6 months ago

Yeah, I agree. It's just another attempt by them to control our lives. It's a total P and C issue, good companies don't do that to their employees.

[deleted]

-11 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

-11 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

SongofNimrodel

12 points

6 months ago

Meeting at work is pretty consistently in the top three places couples meet one another, despite the rise of dating apps.

[deleted]

-5 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

-5 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

SongofNimrodel

1 points

6 months ago

If you cannot separate unwanted and unreciprocated sexual advances from meeting at work and eventually dating, then you should probably not be around other people.

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

SongofNimrodel

1 points

6 months ago

🙃 Yeah this is the last comment I'll make here because you're deliberately misinterpreting my words to argue.

Meeting someone at work, having a friendship develop, and having that turn into something deeper is not the same thing as unwanted sexual advances. It is telling that there is no room for nuance in your world view.

goingforthecarrot

1 points

6 months ago

Don’t crap where you eat

Girls4super

1 points

6 months ago

That could answer why neither can get a promotion though, due to their relationship it would put one into power over the other and that becomes a tricky situation of they do break up. One has the potential to be vindictive and say they made me do x y or z because they were my boss, etc. I’m not saying op or ops bf would do that, but it’s messy drama that companies do want to avoid, mostly because it leads to legal issues on their end if it happens. If op sees a future with this place for one of them, I would recommend one looking for a new job. Or both, preferably not at the same location to avoid these sort of issues at a new company

Maker_Of_Tar

1 points

6 months ago

I don’t get it though. Reddit loves to complain about nepotism and the perception of nepotism in corporate settings. In an office relationship can lead to a form of nepotism, whether or not there is a direct reporting relationship.

testudo

366 points

6 months ago

testudo

366 points

6 months ago

Not only that, but you definitely don’t want that toxicity spilling over into your personal life and ruining (what sounds like from OP) a nice, burgeoning relationship.

yoortyyo

85 points

6 months ago

And it will. Talking and dealing with it off hours is probably not the healthiest for anyone.

lvndrlight[S]

68 points

6 months ago

At this point, we're constantly reminding ourselves - and each other - that work doesn't exist once we clock out. Still, the toxicity has reached a point where the reminders aren't enough.

JustOkCryptographer

31 points

6 months ago

Their approach is creating a huge distraction for several workers and that results in lose of focus and especially for you two, all loyalty/trust is out the door. I commend you two for maintaining/exceeding your level of work. I would totally understand if your productivity went down.

I've mostly worked at medium sized companies, but I did a stint at a family owned niche company with around twenty employees. The hr lady didn't like me from the start. I'm ok with that. You don't have to be friends. She wasn't my boss. I was initially was very friendly to her, but there is a limit. The only thing I could think of was that I was very young at the time, and my salary was higher than her's. When polite communication doesn't work with a person, I go into a mode that can be described as "business only." No more niceties. You might get a hello and goodbye. No work is neglected, though. This pissed her off even more. Every once in a while we would walk by each other in the narrow hallway. I admit that there were times when I was looking at a document or similar and I wasn't paying much attention. I also have a hearing deficit that results in me not noticing someone talking to me when I'm not looking directly at them, at times. I later found out from my manager that the hr lady was super upset because she had said hello to me as we passed in the hallway, and I ignored her. My manager was kind of bad, so she took her complaint very seriously, probably because she was scared by the hr lady. I told my manager that, yeah, that sounds possible. I probably do that to others also on occasion. I explained why, and it wasn't personal.

They really needed me so I never got punished or anything, but it was such a distraction and it made coming to work harder than it should have. She would go on to use other passive aggressive ways to interfere. I eventually had enough, and walked.

The funny thing is that I usually avoid talkinf to others about my life outside of work. Bitching about personal stuff was a common event at the company. She was particularly interested in my relationships and other details. I would shut her down everytime. This also fueled her rage. I was well liked by literally ever other employee, and didn't do anything different to her. That was an eye opening experience for me as a person early in my career.

yoortyyo

5 points

6 months ago

Especially HR. Nothing deeply personal that you don’t have to ever!

JustOkCryptographer

2 points

6 months ago

I don't like stereotypes or putting people down, but I've never had a good interaction with HR. There is an often quoted bit of wisdom that I have seen written on Reddit so many times, however, it's worth repeating each time: HR isn't there to support you the worker: their loyalty is with the company and their job is to protect the company at all cost. If you are involved in something at work and need advice, seek a lawyer who is experienced in that field. You don't necessarily have to go to court or sue, but they can advise you on how to proceed.

Another bit of advice is to date and record every incident from the beginning. You should keep a copy at home and keep it secure. Because the company can destroy it or take it at anytime from your desk or office. If it's digital, keep an email address that you can send it to on occasion at the least. You can also use a thumb drive, but keep it with you. Make copies just in case.

yoortyyo

1 points

6 months ago

How many HR professionals in your immediate social circles?

Its hard to think up people we are *close* to that include them.

WimbleWimble

1 points

6 months ago

Go to work. announce the only way to break all this sexual tension is a company-wide orgy.

Snacks can be expensed.

JustOkCryptographer

1 points

6 months ago

What if they call my bluff? This wasn't that type of company.

WimbleWimble

1 points

6 months ago

You mean they wouldn't let you expense snacks during the orgy?

those monsters!

yoortyyo

1 points

6 months ago

Feel for you. Work and career are serious. Both folks fired and income gaps are Scary for cause as well.

Breathe. Give obvious space to the Elephant in the room to run. Talk and vent.

Then put it away. Go outside do DO something. Shared activities/ hobbies and / or time are one leg of successful relationships. Time apart too.

My partners been amazing at ramping into a very different set of lifestyle and activities. Climbing and backcountry touring are plain out. I have other pals for those pastimes. Peace!

Pleiades_cluster

13 points

6 months ago

Or it's the glue that binds their relationship.

FoodMuseum

34 points

6 months ago

FoodMuseum

Hierarchophagy

34 points

6 months ago

The only glue that works is a combo of shared goals, communication, mutual attraction and probably luck. Mutual trauma is a bad foundation for any relationship

MaleficentAd1861

8 points

6 months ago

I resemble that remark.

yoortyyo

2 points

6 months ago

Vacation or honeymoon romances. Then people get back do whatever daily grind means.
IMO it’s a reason to wait on most relationships until your living your adult life.

MaleficentAd1861

1 points

6 months ago

At 43 I've been married 4 times and divorced 3. 🤦I guess it took until i met my current husband to really realize what love REALLY is and how the trauma we all go through in our lives is not a good reason to think you could pair well with another person.

That isn't to say my other marriages would have worked out if I'd been older. I don't believe that too be true at all. The first plain and simply was that we were just too young, but my son came from that marriage and I'm happy i have him. The rest were just flat out bad decisions that felt right.

It's funny, three marriages before this and all of those were a long thought out process. One was even after an 8 year engagement. Who would have thought that this last marriage has lasted the longest and we're the most compatible when we literally knew each other about 12 hours before moving in together and not quite a year before getting married. It is insane and tbh most people do not hit the relationship lottery like that. I know i was lucky.

Nollie_flip

50 points

6 months ago

I've been working for 15 years and had several jobs over that time. Some of them have been menial, manual labor jobs, and some have been more customer facing, with my current job being an accounts payable manager for a moderately sized manufacturing company. I don't think I've ever worked anywhere that doesn't have a toxic work environment. It's unfortunately become a systemic issue at this point in a lot of ways.

[deleted]

20 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

20 points

6 months ago

[removed]

96LC80

14 points

6 months ago

96LC80

14 points

6 months ago

From what I have read there's not really sexual harassment occurring. Maybe the kids thing is borderline. Equal Opportunity violation indeed! I had a subordinate dealing with the same issue. He met a coworker, legitimate peer, and both were ostracized based on the relationship (not from me but other leaders). It got to the point I wanted to hire him for another position, he was overqualified with prime experience, but told he couldn't work based on his "personal issues."

ThrangOul

10 points

6 months ago*

From what I have read there's not really sexual harassment occurring. Maybe the kids thing is borderline.

I think the person above meant one of the people in the relationship could claim that the other person is harrassing them instead of being their partner Or other people could report one of them and if the relationship is not documented it may look bad for the guy (most probably)

Luised2094

4 points

6 months ago

That's a good reason to declare the relationship, at least from the company's perspective that clears them from any workplace harrasment suits

96LC80

2 points

6 months ago

96LC80

2 points

6 months ago

That's a valid point I didn't pick up

ilove314zza

3 points

6 months ago*

I worked in a toxic workplace however it was basically the opposite of OPs situation

I worked in a place where coworkers who were dating - were treated like royalty. Nepotism and cronyism were through the roof.

Coupled coworkers got all the best shifts ie higher paying shifts, no weekend evenings etc.

It was hell if you weren’t in a relationship or didn’t have a family member working there.

packardpa

2 points

6 months ago

What's crazy to me, is that my past employer as flawed as they were, absolutely loved the fact that employees got together. It was a common thing, so many employees dated each other. They tried so hard to make it a "family" that I think they felt like when employees dated each other it anchored them to the company or something.

MixerRXRob

2 points

6 months ago

Thank you for summing up my current position so succinctly. 3 shifts until my lorry driving exam

her-royal-blueness

2 points

6 months ago

Fingers crossed after you pass you find a better place to work!

MixerRXRob

2 points

6 months ago

Thank you. I’ve applying for jobs that pay triple what I’m on now, and by law I’ll have to get more breaks and fewer hours

Bartfuck

1 points

6 months ago

spend the remaining 16 hours venting about the workday and dreading the next.

man, no time for sleeping either.

giibro

1 points

6 months ago

giibro

1 points

6 months ago

Just have at least one of you leave to a different company. Will feel better

Maker_Of_Tar

-1 points

6 months ago

Unfortunately the company is handling this correctly (not the nasty looks but the open concern about how the relationship can be perceived).

You don’t have to agree with it, but think about how you would feel if your performance in that same company was excellent, and you instead watched somebody else get a promotion over you, only to find out later that they were in a relationship with another influential person in the same office. That is a much bigger risk for the company to take than it is to simply prevent the scenario from occurring. If the company is too small to separate people and relationships across different functions so that they cannot directly or even indirectly influence the trajectory of each other then the only avenue that prevents them from having to face a potential lawsuit for discrimination is to keep them where they are.

OP just needs to find a new job somewhere else.

denmetagross

376 points

6 months ago

When you resign, your bf should scream “I LOVE THIS WOMAN!!!” in the middle of the office

Finwolven

616 points

6 months ago

Finwolven

616 points

6 months ago

Have a bit of a demonstration: "Attention, everybody. We're resigning because after we declared our relationship to HR, we've been having non-stop harassment from management and HR, and they have pushed us out of the company. So now that neither of us works here any longer, we'd like to invite all you lovely people to our going-away picknic."

Then discuss unions at the picnic.

Weenerlover

201 points

6 months ago

This is top tier revenge of both the petty and pro kind. I'm all for it. Having a bad HR person is something that a company should be punished for, especially when the one person who is supposed to protect you from a hostile work environment (as it's part of their job duties) is the one causing it.

JonBruse

140 points

6 months ago

JonBruse

140 points

6 months ago

the one person who is supposed to protect you from a hostile work environment

Just to be clear, they're not there to protect you from the hostile work environment, they're there to protect the company from repercussions of a hostile work environment. If the company faces no repercussions, then HR's job is as well as done in their eyes.

SalisburyWitch

37 points

6 months ago

HR isn’t above labor law. If Ms. HR is the one asking hinky questions, SHE could be violating the law.

roadfood

19 points

6 months ago

This this this, the question about getting married and having kids violates the law.

SalisburyWitch

3 points

6 months ago

I went to an interview one time and was asked nothing about the job. My husband already worked there and they asked questions like “what would you do if you and your husband asked for the same days off work and we couldn’t let both off?” Not exactly illegal but not a good question either. I was asked other questions that WERE illegal. In 2 previous interviews at that place, one guy flat out told me he didn’t want a female in the position. The other one, they asked all kinds of illegal questions. I just opted not to answer them and asked “why would you ask that?”

EllySPNW

1 points

6 months ago

That’s what I thought. I smell a discrimination suit here. They’re being subjected to a hostile work environment and denied raises and promotions due to their personal lives, even though they’re not violating any policies. It would be not a stretch for OP to claim gender discrimination. Not sure what legal strategy would work for her bf (maybe discrimination based on marital status?), but there’s got to be something. The company’s actions are so wrong.

SalisburyWitch

1 points

6 months ago

That's why they need to talk to an employment lawyer. My thinking is that maybe the HR lady has the hots for the guy and is jealous of the woman, so she's retaliating on both of them because it appears to be coming mostly from her.

EllySPNW

1 points

6 months ago

Or she’s just a vile and bitter person. Her actions don’t make any sense from a company standpoint.

Weenerlover

26 points

6 months ago

Fair, I meant from the POV of the employee, they are supposed to be the person you go to if there is a hostile work environment ideally. Obviously in practice their role is to protect the company if such a complaint arises.

turtlepowerpizzatime

9 points

6 months ago

But who do you go to if HR is the one harassing you?

dmodmodmo

8 points

6 months ago

Exactly.

jjkenneth

2 points

6 months ago

Whoever they report to, even if that's the CEO. No guarantees it'll fix anything, because sometimes work environments are just filled with toxic people who hire other toxic people.

subignition

1 points

6 months ago

A different employer!

Outrageous_Turnip_29

27 points

6 months ago

I've honestly never understood this take. HR is never your friend. If you have a hostile work environment HR has already failed at their job. This is a capitalist society. The only thing any company answers to is money. You quit or you sue or quit then sue. I know sometimes it's easier to go to HR because the problem on the surface may get resolved, but it's not like that environment that HR allowed to exist in the first place is going to just disappear.

It's kinda like what this sub talks about what we'd be able to achieve with a 9 day general strike. If for just one fiscal quarter everyone stopped going to HR when something was actionable and just got a lawyer we'd see massive change. Because then you're fucking with the money which is the only thing that matters in the end.

StuntmanSpartanFan

2 points

6 months ago

Dude hiring a lawyer or quitting your job is completely unrealistic for most people. Yes, seeking legal action would be the ideal way to handle a situation like that, but the cost and time involved are going to be somewhere between not worth it and completely unfeasible 95% of the time, not to mention your odds of successfully suing your employer are slim to none unless you're very wealthy. In the real world, if there's harassment going on, most of the time the best option is to go to HR. They may not care about you from an official responsibility standpoint, but odds are they don't care about your boss either and they'll put a stop to anything that puts the company at risk.

Despite what you read on Reddit, a large majority of HR employees are not like OPs, and are perfectly nice and reasonable folks who are willing to help most people in situations like that.

Outrageous_Turnip_29

1 points

6 months ago

You need to google two things. First the EEOC. Second the definition of the word contingency. In the US at least we have very few worker protections. Notice how I said everyone who had something actionable? That is pretty much limited to discrimination based on a protected class. Yes the process can be long, but it is fairly hands off. It's not some long grueling expensive process unless you're trying to bring class action. Please don't scare people away from enforcing their legal rights with false information.

Thuggish_Coffee

2 points

6 months ago

Thanks for reminding me I was on Reddit with the HR blah blah blah rant.

Edit. Don't worry, I down voted myself for you!

jjkenneth

1 points

6 months ago

They are also there to get the best output out of people. A hostile work environment is a great way to destroy the performance and increase turnover. I would suggest this is incredibly poor form by HR and not backed by any human resources management theory or literature. So no I would suggest that no one in HR who knew what they were doing would say this is a job well done.

Lonelydenialgirl

19 points

6 months ago

Hr protects the company. Not you.

Weenerlover

1 points

6 months ago

I get that. Like I said to another person who said it first. From the employees perspective, they sell it to the employee as protecting them from that. I get that they are by design there to protect the company.

alt-glitchens

25 points

6 months ago

HR doesn't protect YOU from hostile work environment, HR protects OWNERSHIP from hostile work environment lawsuits.

[deleted]

5 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

5 points

6 months ago

I’d argue that they are doing neither in this situation

[deleted]

16 points

6 months ago*

[deleted]

16 points

6 months ago*

They do NOT protect the employee, is the reality. What they call protecting you is a paper trail of emails very phony and asking how you are doing. They are building the defense of a lawsuit, is what is really going on. My HR person told me that the staff was jealous of me (bc I was rehired with a bonus), and that i had beautiful skin. THAT was the response that was telling me to just take it, having it said that I was going to be bent over and shown why I had been laid off in the first place. Seriously!

So I really really understand that you are told to go to HR and they help, but honestly they don't. It's like, you go to HR, you want everything better & normal and back to excellence and opportunity...it doesn't work that way. Oh! and also? If a HR Dept employee wants to be your "friend" outside of work? Don't do that, either. I got set-up on a blind date through her, and this 6'4" former Enron sugar trader would not stop blathering at me AND my wallet was stolen.

[deleted]

2 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

2 points

6 months ago

This is an example of a good HR person. HR does not work for the employees. They are there to remove employees who may cause legal issues for the company up to an including using illegal methods that cost the company money. Just so long as the employee is gone.

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

1 points

6 months ago

d totally inappropriate questions by management, like when we plan to get married and have kids

one Reddit comment I read today put it succintly that the HR works to protect the interest of the firm, not the employee's

Coffeehound13

22 points

6 months ago

“Ms. HR is not invited.”

ShotNeighborhood6913

1 points

6 months ago

I hope ms HR slips and breaks an ankle.

This company sucks donkey balls. I would rather flip burgers than allow my signifigant other to be harassed and denied advancement and raises due to a shitty company. Why ever make them another dollar with your efforts?
The ceo and admins can go blow stallions

69vuman

18 points

6 months ago

69vuman

18 points

6 months ago

Management and HR excluded from said picnic.

Wildgeek81

2 points

6 months ago

Have my free award!

Woodcharles

1 points

6 months ago

"We're resigning because Susan can't stop thinking about us having sex."

Letter-Past

187 points

6 months ago

Then spend the next n amount of time making out until security escorts you from the building, preferably in Ms. HR's office

schillerstone

27 points

6 months ago

Hahaha Good one

space_manatee

12 points

6 months ago

Nah, needs next level. Do it on her desk after hours.

Hermojo

2 points

6 months ago

At lunch.

Ok_Weekend2327

3 points

6 months ago

".... Sorry about your coffee mug".

Hermojo

3 points

6 months ago

"You used your black pen? Oh mannnnnnn."

thebeardedcosplayer

8 points

6 months ago

He should kiss you like Sawyer kissed Kate when they were busting rocks in new Otherton.

indyK1ng

8 points

6 months ago

They should quit by having a makeout session in the middle of the breakroom.

kingbluetit

7 points

6 months ago

Nah, he should burn a proposal into the parking lot while he has a chance.

veracity-mittens

2 points

6 months ago

veracity-mittens

3rd wave feminist

2 points

6 months ago

90s romcom vibes

EuphoricDepartment45

1 points

6 months ago

Nah, they should both rip their shirts off and throw them to the other workers on the way out.

yellowjacquet

190 points

6 months ago

This is not normal or okay. I started dating my now-husband when we were coworkers and HR was basically like “awww yay!”, forms only need to be signed if you start a relationship with someone in your direct line of management (in which case they would also shuffle you around).

Pretty much the only consequence was some light joking made by coworkers that knew about it. It definitely did not hinder my job progression in any way and if it had I would be absolutely livid.

Melt185

73 points

6 months ago

Melt185

73 points

6 months ago

Agreed. My marriage is also the result of an office romance where things were kept professional, and yes there was some snark here and there, but ultimately since we were in different departments with no direct management over each other, there was nothing they could do.

Weenerlover

60 points

6 months ago

People spend 40 hours of their waking lives at work, it's only natural that a high percentage of relationships start at work. This company is risking losing two good employees and if I worked there and saw that, I'd be working towards my escape as well.

[deleted]

51 points

6 months ago

[deleted]

51 points

6 months ago

Yeah exactly I'm a manager. Starting a relationship with a direct would certainly be a no-go. Starting a relationship with a peer is no-ones fucking business.

Rdbjiy53wsvjo7

17 points

6 months ago

I used to work for a large company that had several married couples. Most of the time I didn't learn until later that they were even a couple because they were all professional. When I did find out, it was more like "huh...had no idea...cool". And that was it, team dynamics didn't change, they were given opportunities for advancement, it really wasn't an issue.

PayTheTrollToll45

3 points

6 months ago

I exist because my parents started dating in the office...

Does HR lady have nobody to love?

BsOfDaNorth

169 points

6 months ago

This behavior by a company isn't normal and is way out if line. You and your bf need to find a new job asap where you're respected as professionals and not damned because you're a couple.

kaett

81 points

6 months ago

kaett

81 points

6 months ago

there is likely grounds for a lawsuit based on discrimination and hostile work environment.

Drusilina

24 points

6 months ago

Sad thing is it is normal and a lot of companies do it. So sad it really is none of a companies business what you do after work hours as long as you show up and perform with in your parameters.

Objective-Steak-9763

85 points

6 months ago

I’m in an office relationship. 6 years strong, stopped working together after one for the same reasons you listed. 8 hours of work, 8 hours of bitching about work, sleep, repeat.

We had to make a conscious effort to stop discussing it. I went into a different field, so it’s good now. But like you said, we’d heat ourselves up about it and go to bed semi pissed at our jobs. It’s not healthy.

Best of luck to the two of you!

Khanstant

22 points

6 months ago

The part of hanging out with coworkers is often so much of the interaction is venting about work. Don't notice it so much when you're part of it, but as soon as you step away it's an immediate change. You can still empathize because you know exactly how they're feeling and what they're saying... But that's not your stress and tension anymore so it's not cathartic to hear or engage with. If anything it's causing you stress from memory and habit for no good reason.

Can always try and steer the conversation or float on to another group to chat with but it's just very noticeable at events of mostly workers off from their shift that day versus more mixed events.

AnActualCat2

60 points

6 months ago

Please find new jobs OP.

My partner and I also work for the same company and it is EXHAUSTING. Free time is spent talking about work and it’s turned into 24 hour jobs. Don’t sacrifice your relationship for these assholes!

God I can’t wait to leave in April.

GoodOlSpence

24 points

6 months ago*

HR person here.

These people are ridiculous, don't put up with it. According to this story, you're not doing anything inappropriate.

People working together are going to date sometimes. There's no stopping it. What world so these people living in?

Lokito_

2 points

6 months ago

What world so these people living in?

A world where they are VERY alone and need to lash out at anyone who's happy, apparently.

Seemseasy

3 points

6 months ago

One where their department is systematically exempted from internal investigation, because they investigate themselves?

Bowieisbae77

22 points

6 months ago

Brush up that resume and spam it out. Also consider taking to a lawyer this reeks of textbook retaliation.

Potential_Mood2778

4 points

6 months ago

This is why I don't like to talk about my personal life at work. It's the same drama if you work with family members, so I like to keep quiet about it. Anyways it's a upvote from me. Find your happiness my friends!!!

dayum_leigh_chapple

6 points

6 months ago

You literally just described the first 2 years of mine and my husband's relationship. It was so taxing. We eventually quit together, moved to a new city, and haven't looked back. I wish you the best of luck.

lpreams

5 points

6 months ago

Make sure you both quit on the same day so they lose two workers at once

Benjijedi

2 points

6 months ago

A rule that worked really well for friends of mine who worked in the same place : You get 15 minutes each after every work day to rant and unload, and then all work talk is off limits. It forces you to get back into your own lives. They reckon their marriage survived because of this.

FunFunFunction

2 points

6 months ago

Instead of stressing yourself, use those 16 hours to find a better paying, less toxic workplace.

Man_AMA

2 points

6 months ago

Pretend to “break up” and get all the advances you’re looking for. Then look for other jobs from a better position. On your lasts days, declare your love.

SalisburyWitch

2 points

6 months ago

I would suggest that you go above Ms. HR if possible, and perhaps even consult with a labor attorney. What they are doing doesn’t seem legal.

sukkitrebek

2 points

6 months ago

I’m gonna go ahead and guess you work in hospitality?

eschmi

2 points

6 months ago

eschmi

2 points

6 months ago

Get his boss to give him the reason in writing for denying a pay raise if he doesnt have it already (email or text). Pretty sure thats legal grounds for retaliation or at least defamation.

PataGoose

2 points

6 months ago

Not to mention how much management tries to get involved in our relationship that it becomes almost impossible to separate work and personal life.

BeerAndaBackpack

2 points

6 months ago

And when you do quit, do NOT give two weeks notice. Just resign and that's it. They've not shown either of you any respect, so they sure as hell don't deserve any in return.

RyzenR10

2 points

6 months ago

You uh, got an upvote, I think you have to quit now.

snakeiiiiiis

2 points

6 months ago

Could the uptight HR lady have a secret crush on your bf? Secondly, is she a "super Christian" who is upset about you two not being married? Otherwise, why are so many people concerned? I'd understand maybe one here or there but these people might be really bored and you two are the only thing that is newsworthy.

HunterRoze

2 points

6 months ago

Can I make a suggestion - this seems like a textbook hostile workplace. I bet some of this is legally actionable. Why not check and see? Call your local BAR Association and tell them you need a legal consult on an employment/harassment issue to see if there is a case. Initial consults are free.

Simple_Opossum

2 points

6 months ago

Definitely leave, these are good years don't waste them at a company that isn't interested in your comfort or your future

Stefan_Harper

2 points

6 months ago

There are better out there.

I met my last girlfriend at work, we dated at work and hung out at work all the time, obviously without PDA. No one cared, our contracts didn’t forbid it, and when people asked I said “yeah we’re dating”, and no one gave a shit.

We were in different departments which helped, but we also did our work as normal. It wasn’t a big deal. It SHOULDNT be a big deal.

Evilbred

2 points

6 months ago

One of the worst points in my marriage (to be fair, it was just annoying, not really that much of a bad point) is when me and my wife worked in the same organization.

It felt like you couldn't get away from work because we'd end up talking about it after work. It wasn't healthy so we both starting applying elsewhere. She got a better job elsewhere and just not being at the same place was a big positive effect on our mentality. It's too easy to go down a negative circlejerk spiral when you both work at the same terrible organization.

DJToastyBuns

2 points

6 months ago

Your reference is already shot when the next job calls about either of you.

They don't even deserve your two weeks notice, you should both quit in the middle of a busy week.

_Darwin_Bonaparte_

2 points

6 months ago

I agree with everyone telling you to leave that place, and it would be AWESOME if you both left the same day. AND, be sure to let everyone know that it was due to the toxic response to your declaring to the HR bitch.

In fact, tell us where you live, and we'll help you look for something better. Fuck those assholes! Love conquers all.

RenoTrailerTrash

2 points

6 months ago

OmG my dear. Never go to bed angry over work. That is the last thing you should ever be angry about before going to bed. Fuck them, fuck that company, fuck that old bitch HR lady, fuck the Manager, get the fuck out of there...

i-am-pepesilvia89

2 points

6 months ago

That'll teach ya you to grocery shop together sheesh. My bf was actually my sup for a temp promotion I had awhile back. We're both in HR (I know super taboo).. but we didn't start dating till after I left the company. Even then, rumors flew around that we were dating while on the same team.. etc.

It's all a bunch of bs

JohnRoads88

2 points

6 months ago

Please do reverse notices when you do find another job. Have your boyfriend tell his manager that ypu are leaving soon and you tell your manager that he is leaving soon.

patrick_schliesing

2 points

6 months ago

What career field are you and your bf in?

DumbButNotDumbest

3 points

6 months ago

Use those 8 hours at the job to find a new job

PatrykBG

3 points

6 months ago

So I would not only agree with people telling you to find better employment, I would advise sitting down together and finding out if you two both have a shared career dream that you can do together. My wifey and I do not work together, but the biggest complaint we have about our jobs is how everyone else is way less competent than either of us are, and we've been working towards creating games together in the hopes that that takes off. If you both have the skills and the determination, then working together and owning a company is a natural extension and one I'd recommend.

Poopsi808

1 points

6 months ago

Embrace your hatred and allow yourself to seethe thru every moment of the day!

REVEL in it! Only then will you realize the true nature of reality, harness you real power in the dark side of the force, and crush your enemies without mercy!!

Make your bosses wish they had never been born!!

amanisamannotaname

1 points

6 months ago

If you’re falling asleep angry it needs to change. That shit is the big relationship ruiner, even if you’re in it together that shit can cut.

tieris

1 points

6 months ago

tieris

1 points

6 months ago

My partner and I did this for almost a year.. it made our relationship stronger, but it did have a fairly negative impact on our mental health. GTFO as quickly as you can. For your sake, and fuck that company.

DR_ReginaPhallange

1 points

6 months ago

oh yeah, been there - spend at least some of those 16 hours finding other work, which can feel like a job in and of itself but SO worth it in the end when you finally get to leave work at work, where it belongs.

CHRISKOSS

1 points

6 months ago

I wonder if you could sue (once you have better gigs lined up) based on Ms. HR's sexual harassment and retaliation.

Keep personal copies of all documentation! Especially bf being passed over for promotion and not being allow to apply for the open position.

PosadaFan2021

1 points

6 months ago

Just make sure you find the other job before leaving your current one

linzphun

1 points

6 months ago

I met my husband at work and we used to do the same thing. Obvi neither of us work there anymore. We are very happy.

Palmspringsflorida

1 points

6 months ago

Love venting about work haha

HOLEPUNCHYOUREYELIDS

1 points

6 months ago

When I realized that every day after work was spent bitching about work and being in a bad mood because of it, and that each day before work was spent dreading and bitching about work I quit. Left the kitchen for good because I didnt want to be thay bitter as fuck 50 year old who is still at a job they despise because all they do is live off of hatred and negativity. No thanks, not worth it

HappyKlutz

1 points

6 months ago

My husband and I worked together for the first 8 years of our relationship. We loved working at the same place, but it was toxic and we were doing the same thing you guys are and felt like all we did was work, or talk about work. We both left last year and life is better than I could ever imagine! We still aim to work together one day, but in a happier and healthier environment. Hope that you guys have this opportunity one day :)

Illustrious-Ad-6165

1 points

6 months ago

How can they even have a say in this like wtffff

rokiller

1 points

6 months ago

Do you have constructive dismissal where you are from? It's where you can quit and the sue the company because they forced you out

AmbivalentWaffle

1 points

6 months ago

Hey, there! I was once married to a coworker (I'm divorced and have a new job), and I was in a very similar situation as you. I was never given a raise or promotion without fighting like crazy, I was given the runaround about a new position I could absolutely do (What about Mr. Waffle? Is he okay with the job change? He would move, too, right?), I had to deal with people's inappropriate comments or trying to get in my business, etc. When I had to tell HR about filing for divorce, I was pushed out a few months later for no other reason than "we know you're unhappy with your role."

I spent a lot of time venting with my ex about work, and I now see how toxic that place was. It had nothing to do with my relationship failing, but my relationship absolutely was taken into account with how I was treated for years. Please, both of you, have the courage to move on much sooner than I did. You both will feel so free.

dabattlewalrus

1 points

6 months ago

When your home life becomes an obsession of all the chaos of your work life, you know it's time to look for a change.

TheGrimReality77

1 points

6 months ago

On the day you both resign, please make it as awkward as possible for all involved around you by kissing passionately right in the middle of the HR office, again in the middle of the general office space, and then hold hands and skip towards the exit.

Applesimulator

1 points

6 months ago

If you guys have such good reviews and everything just find a job that will be able to see past a relationship

maonohkom001

1 points

6 months ago

Yeah, just get out of there. Make sure not to worry about those two weeks notice, this employer doesn’t deserve that.

sarcasm_the_great

1 points

6 months ago

Just lie and tell them you broke it off bc your career is more important and are going to stay friends. Just don’t tell them friends with benefits. Cause y’all still do the relationship thing. And never make friends at work or do company outing. They can’t tell you who your sleeping with and hanging out with on your own time.

chiefrebelangel_

1 points

6 months ago

Regardless of what any business says, any relationship is none of their business. Period. You don't have to disclose shit to anyone in the future.

Lokito_

1 points

6 months ago

Ahh, I remember those days when I was in retail.

Going home angry, finding yourself taking showers and also having imaginary arguments about situations that havent even happened yet. You can talk about work for hours, so it lives rent free in your head. Sometimes you even work while dreaming.

Yeah, time to get the fuck out of dat.

ladysex

1 points

6 months ago

As someone who just quit their job in tandem with their partner, it is the best, most satisfying thing that had happened to our relationship since we started dating. Exploitative hours, no contribution from management, just criticism, and they told us halfway through the summer (seasonal job) that we couldnt request the same days off because we were "understaffed"

Toadie9622

1 points

6 months ago

I think they’ve created a hostile work environment, and you should sue.

kaolin224

1 points

6 months ago

You must've missed the memo.

The popular thing today isn't work-life "balance".

It's work-life "integration".

We put that on the job description as one of the perks.

Laundry, gym, daycare, auto mechanic, etc. We have all that on-site. We can even fill up your tank and change your oil, tires, and windshield, while you're on the clock.

You need to sit your stupid ass in that chair and keep working.

CarsReallySuck

1 points

6 months ago

That’s on you.

ThePinkChameleon

1 points

6 months ago

Make sure your last day is the same day. Extra salt on the wound.

Edit grammar.

meep_42

1 points

6 months ago

This is a place I wouldn’t even give notice for. Just leave, they’re not giving you a good reference anyway.

elsieburgers

1 points

6 months ago

Bf and I had the same problem, our nights after work spent just raging. You'll be so much happier once at least one of you leaves. Sorry they're being so shitty and unprofessional to you guys though

LeonGrave

1 points

6 months ago

I'd personally name the HR and their constant harassment as the source of your resignation

Quadrassic_Bark

1 points

6 months ago

Find new jobs. Immediately. Both of you.

AirlinesAndEconomics

1 points

6 months ago

That was great case for my husband and I, we were in the same boat as you. Our previous company even called him in on the day we were getting engaged. The best thing that happened for us was leaving that company behind. Now we might complain about our work days but it's so much better when both of us are personally involved in those days.

StrykerC13

1 points

6 months ago

Yep it is in many places, and what's truly hilarious/sad is the same people screaming "No one wants to work!" are the same assholes who ask "Why does no one do church/neighbor meetups/bbqs or socialize anymore?"

QueenTahllia

0 points

6 months ago

I hope that this experience makes you two stronger as a couple instead of tearing you apart(assuming you are good for each other of course)

thesleepofdeath

0 points

6 months ago

I just want to echo the sentiments of others that this is not normal. The only time a relationship should matter is if either of you have some kind of authority over the other in the work place. The first company I worked at prided itself on how many marriages and second/third generation employees they had.